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WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Discussion pertaining to Lansing, Jackson, Owosso, and all areas from Alma to Hillsdale
Schyster
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:35 pm

Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Schyster »

I've been a little curious as to why WKAR doesn't do more to head off Michigan Radio in the Lansing area. WUOM gets fairly decent ratings already in Lansing with their NPR talk programming. Meanwhile, the programming on 870/105.1 during the day is mostly filler BBC and niche shows. Why not try keeping some of that donor money in town?
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Ben Zonia
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Ben Zonia »

When U. of M. applied for WFUM-FM 91.1 in Flint, as I recall they mentioned in the application or in new stories that some local programming was planned. The Flint Board of Education soon approached the Regents/Michigan Radio about doing some local programming, and selling off WFBE to a commercial entity several years before they finally did. It was some time in the mid 1980s. The University of Michigan wasn't interested in local programming once they had the permit. So I wouldn't expect that they would put local programming on WLNZ if they took over either. They never had local programming on WVGR either to my knowledge.

How embarrassing for U. of M. to invade Spartan Land. Maybe MSU could buy WCBN to get back at U. of M. They could put a simulcast of WDBM on it.
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radioandtventhusiast
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by radioandtventhusiast »

MWmetalhead wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 6:18 pm WUOM (and to a lesser degree, WVGR) already enjoys very significant listening in the Lansing MSA.

Adding WLNZ would only serve to improve reception in downtown Lansing and little more. WUOM comes in fine in the car all across the greater Lansing area.
It also has decent reception in non-car radios as well.
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Ben Zonia
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Ben Zonia »

The original WFUM-FM began operating in the 1950s. It was 400 watts ERP on 107.1, Channel 296A, from the top of the Hurley Hospital building, so for lack of immediately available information, from a HAAT of approximately 175 feet. At the time, the maximum facilities for Class As was 1000 watts from 250 feet. According to FCC rules at the time, two full facility cochannel Class A stations would have had to be about 45 miles apart, so it wouldn't have been a problem then for WPAG-FM on 107.1 and WFUM-FM to both operate on 107.1. In 1962, new rules made Class A maximum facilities 3000 watts from 300 feet, and required 65 miles for full spacing. A fully spaced Class A then needed to be somewhere South of Saginaw to be fully spaced. Around 1960, WUOM-FM 91.7 increased to 115000 watts from circa 400 feet HAAT, and later 230000 watts from circa 400 feet. It put a 1 mV/m F(50,50) contour close enough to Flint that the Michigan Radio people decided it was unneeded and gave up the facility. In 1985, they decided the signal in Flint wasn't good enough and applied for 15 kW DA from 490 feet, later, due to actual DA parameters, increased to 17.5 kW from 490 feet.

It appears that now U of M is going to acquire lower power facilities in several other cities to extend their reach into terrain and building cluttered areas that WUOM-FM doesn't serve that well.
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Ben Zonia
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Ben Zonia »

Here's the WUOM History Card.

http://licensing.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/prod/c ... r_id=70892

Here's a link to the missing information on WFUM 107.1 and every other FM station in the nation from each year to develop a timeline. For each year, click on the link for FM stations. Scroll to Michigan and see a concise technical record of stations by state. For a while, noncomms weren't listed, but the early history is there including noncomms. Remember that because WJIM-TV Channel 6 was right in the middle of the state, and extending to WCML-TV and WLUC-TV also, development of the 88-92 MHz NCE-FM Band was quite limited in much of the state. WDET 101.9, WFBE 95.1, WVGR 104.1, and WMUK 102.1 were all because of Channel 6 rules, and those areas being in the Grade B Contour fringe area of WJIM-TV. That was changed because reasonably priced software and serious study of the NCE-FM Channel Rules to find the loopholes became available. The Channel 6 rules still apply in areas where there still are digital and analog channel 6s, full power and translators, etc.

https://worldradiohistory.com/Radio_Ann ... r_Page.htm

WFUM (FM) 91.1 has no History Card, as it was applied for and came on after 1980.
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FredLeonard
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by FredLeonard »

Schyster wrote: Mon Jun 07, 2021 9:56 am I've been a little curious as to why WKAR doesn't do more to head off Michigan Radio in the Lansing area. WUOM gets fairly decent ratings already in Lansing with their NPR talk programming. Meanwhile, the programming on 870/105.1 during the day is mostly filler BBC and niche shows. Why not try keeping some of that donor money in town?
In the most recent book, WKAR-FM and WUOM are tied. WKAR is almost nothing; clearly the NPR news and information audience is going with WUOM.

At some point, MSU reorganized and now the WKAR stations are operated by the CommArtsSci faculty, which seems out to prove George Bernard Shaw was right: Those who can not do, teach. One sign the stations have gone to pot: When a national story breaks in the area, NPR goes to WUOM to cover it for Morning Edition or All Things Considered.

WUOM (and its repeaters) now call themselves "Michigan Radio." They apparently have convinced a lot of people that they are THE official state network. Many states do have them (Minnesota Public Radio, Wisconsin Public Radio..... ) but not Michigan. The leading public radio stations have all gone to News/Talk. In many markets there are secondary (and tertiary) public radio stations doing classical or alternative, but that's not where the listeners are - or the money. WKAR has made themselves an anachronism and irrelevant.

It's ironic, when NPR launched, WUOM stuck with their "educational" and classical format and WKAR moved aggressively into news and information. What happened?
ChrisWL1980
Posts: 893
Joined: Wed Nov 06, 2019 2:36 am

Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by ChrisWL1980 »

For the three people who care, WKAR-FM is back in HD. The HD2 is a WKAR-AM/W286DC simulcast.
39pelican
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by 39pelican »

Hopefully it goes to Michigan Radio. It’s super annoying when I’m listening to an interesting story and it cuts out as I reach downtown.
Greg Buben
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Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:52 am

Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Greg Buben »

I have always been a follower of the Lansing radio market and I took the radio class at LCC. I was a student before
WLNZ went on the air and I was happy when WLNZ got the FM license although I never got a paying job there. What I
want to know is did University of Michigan buy it as the rumours said or not? I realize it's a low power FM that can help
localize their "Michigan Radio" NPR format but if they obtain it that means there will be one less non commercial outlet
for music. Please let me know what's happening with WLNZ in Lansing.
Greg Buben
Mega Hertz
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Mega Hertz »

radioandtventhusiast wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 10:54 am
MWmetalhead wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 6:18 pm WUOM (and to a lesser degree, WVGR) already enjoys very significant listening in the Lansing MSA.

Adding WLNZ would only serve to improve reception in downtown Lansing and little more. WUOM comes in fine in the car all across the greater Lansing area.
It also has decent reception in non-car radios as well.
Decent? I have an old Kenwood tuner from 1979 with a signal level on it. This is the only station that comes in damn near all the way to the top! WHMI is a mere few miles up the road and doesn't come in that good. Decent is an understatement!

I've never thought to ask; where is their TX?
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Kennelly Heaviside
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Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Kennelly Heaviside »

Barely into Washtenaw County, near Peach Mountain, off Stinchfield Woods Rd., North of Dexter. South of Pinckney. Kind of in the middle of nowhere. You can't get there from here.

https://www.fccdata.org/?facid=&call=WU ... d=&lang=en

I think WJIM-TV 6 thought of itself as the gatekeeper of noncommercial allotments, in a very populated area of Michigan, and almost all major cities within their Grade B fringe area. They allowed WKAR on 90.5 without too much objection, and WUOM almost out of the objectionable 88-92 NCE-FM band on 91.7, and still within the Grade A contour of WJIM, but in the middle of nowhere population wise, without too much objection. WEMU even had to put up a WJIM-TV translator in Ann Arbor in order in order to get the pop count down to manageable numbers. All the major consultants swore that the WLGH application would never be accepted or approved, so there wasn't much objection at first. The FCC had to rewrite some of the channel 6 rules to keep it from being approved with Circular Polarization. But they said it couldn't be done but it was. No one had bothered to look to see if it really had to be on the WJIM/WLNS Channel 6 tower. It turned out that if you read the rules, it was acceptable to be nearby.
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Greg Buben
Posts: 164
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:52 am

Re: WLNZ to Michigan Radio?

Unread post by Greg Buben »

I still would like to know if U-M still wants LCC's weak little WLNZ. It may help them in downtown Lansing but for people who
want a non commercial music source it would be a devastating loss. I personally think "Michigan Radio" can be heard in
Lansing well enough with WVGR-FM 104.1, WUOM-FM 91.7, and on line. LCC should just keep the low powered station the
way it is and with all of the Sparties in the area they would avoid it. Besides that it you want NPR news/ talk in Lansing
the Sparties have their own NPR news/ talk WKAR-AM 870 from sunup to sundown and their 24 hour repeater at 105 FM.
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