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Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Discussion pertaining to Grand Rapids, Kalamazoo, Muskegon, Battle Creek, Big Rapids, and Michiana
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MWmetalhead
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Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by MWmetalhead » Thu Jan 13, 2022 10:14 pm

WKFR continues to beat Hits 96.5 handily. Jack FM on 106.5 is earning only modestly better numbers than it did at 96.5.

Impressive showings for WRKR and B93. Star 105.7 is benefitting from WVFM's demise.

Win 98.5 has become a near non-factor in this market.

https://ratings.radio-online.com/content/arb251


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by CJ » Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:20 am

WIN 98.5 ping pongs back and forth every handful of years of embracing Kalamazoo as part of their audience and not. It seems like lately, they have not. It interesting how this market has often considered a GR station as the country station of choice, but the station that has a sign out front of the Midwest offices on West Main, they don’t. It’s always been a “Battle Creek” station.

I wonder how much life K102.5 has. Those are some sad numbers and they are pretty much a satellite station of WFGR for most of the day it seems. Judging by the strong 105.7 numbers, it is time to flip to Adult Contemporary?



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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Michigan Media » Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:24 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:Win 98.5 has become a near non-factor in this market.
CJ wrote:WIN 98.5 ping pongs back and forth every handful of years of embracing Kalamazoo as part of their audience and not. It seems like lately, they have not. It interesting how this market has often considered a GR station as the country station of choice, but the station that has a sign out front of the Midwest offices on West Main, they don’t. It’s always been a “Battle Creek” station.
WIN 98.5 will never be relevant in the Kalamazoo market with their current tower location. B93 has a booming signal throughout all of Kalamazoo County and the surrounding area.

CJ wrote:I wonder how much life K102.5 has. Those are some sad numbers and they are pretty much a satellite station of WFGR for most of the day it seems. Judging by the strong 105.7 numbers, it is time to flip to Adult Contemporary?
The writing is on the wall for K102.5. I will be very surprised if Classic Hits is on 102.5 by the end of March. Adult Contemporary is an obvious choice for 102.5. I would welcome a younger-skewing Rock format. Hell, WGRD's crappy signal outperformed K102.5 in 12+.



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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by MWmetalhead » Fri Jan 14, 2022 5:42 pm

I do not know if that is the right signal for an AC station. I think the current dip might prove to be short lived. I'd stay the course with Classic Hits for now.

I think 96.5 is the station that should consider a flip to Adult Contemporary or to Active Rock. They are on the losing end of the battle with WKFR and always will be.

Battle Creek is lucky in that it has both Q106 (good signal from tower 30 miles east) and 104.9 The Edge.

Q106 is a vastly superior station to WGRD.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by CJ » Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:00 pm

I would welcome a 104.9 The Edge type in Kalamazoo anywhere on the dial. I wish the signal would have a stronger reach to 131.



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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 11:16 am

I remember back circa 1980, WGRD-FM applied for around 30 kW directional from the site at Dias Hill, from 13 kW nondirectional. Apparently they didn't go through with it because they were concerned about the signal in Kalamazoo. I see it still does draw some ratings, but the competition is much increased from circa 1980. Now that the actual measured DA patterns are available online, I can definitely see why they didn't. Looking at the actual patterns of Cumulus' WLAV-FM and WFBE, and the known fact that the actual relative field is usually substantially less than the FCC pattern envelope, restrictions toward what is now short spaced WCKL 97.9 would probably have made the pattern less than even 13 kW ERP in a wider arc than just toward Chicago.
Last edited by Ben Zonia on Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by MWmetalhead » Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:09 pm

Wouldn't WJLB-FM in Detroit also have been a consideration?


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:17 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Sat Jan 15, 2022 1:09 pm
Wouldn't WJLB-FM in Detroit also have been a consideration?
Both WJLB-FM and WKCQ were in short spaced zones under the old Section 73.213, which allowed full Class B 50 kW/500 feet HAAT facilities (125 miles 0 kHz/80 miles 200 kHz). WLUP/WCKL was in the zone that only allowed 20 kW/500 feet HAAT facilities (100 miles 0 kHz/65 miles 200 kHz), or DA at 20 kW toward WLUP. Then there's a 2 dB/10 degree restriction, which is hard to meet without lower ERP in even wider arcs. It looks like they might have been able to put all the overlap over water, but that wasn't allowed then apparently.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:52 pm

I will check to see if David Gleason's (aka Eduardo's) worldradiohistory.com site has the Part 73 CFR volume from the 1970s, which had the distances in miles, instead of kilometers. The last time I checked, he didn't have the one in miles. In fact, 50 kW/500 feet was allowed at 124.5 miles 0 kHz and 79.5 miles 200 kHz. 20 kW/500 feet was 99.5 miles 0 kHz and 64.5 miles 200 kHz. 10 kW/500 feet was 74.5 miles 0 kHz, 49.5 miles 200 kHz. Less than that, it was 5 kW/500 feet. Those stations were in full compliance under previous rules. 60 dBu was the protected contour for ALL Classes, and contour overlap was used, like NCE-FM still is.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 3:59 pm

I'll have to research this further. WDOW-FM was on 97.7 before it moved to 92.1. It appears that the WGRD-FM became short spaced to WDOW-FM at some point after 1964.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 6:35 pm

WDOW was coowned with WFUR.

There appears to have been a coordination of the WGRD-FM move to Dias Hill, and WDOW-FM moving from 97.7 to 92.1. It seems like there was another nearby Petition for Rule Making to drop in 97.7 further away, that was part of the changes.
Last edited by Ben Zonia on Sat Jan 15, 2022 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sat Jan 15, 2022 7:09 pm

They moved 97.7 to Goshen, IN contemporaneously.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sun Jan 16, 2022 12:34 am

After reviewing the rules from 1964, if WGRD-FM and WDOW-FM had both been authorized before the early 1960s, they were far enough apart that they both could have operated with full facilities, as they were in the first short spaced zone. So the only restriction in the second short spacing zone was WLUP. But that would mean a 4 dB null, so it would require an arc of 40 degrees less than 50 kW/500 foot equivalent. That would end up less than the 50 kW/500 feet equivalent for more than 40 degrees. If you look at the WLAV-FM pattern, there would probably be other arcs less than the 50 kW/500 foot equivalent.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by MWmetalhead » Sun Jan 16, 2022 7:45 am

As built, WGRD's signal in the Kalamazoo area is shabby. Reception in the northern part of town is OK, but once one gets south of I-94, the signal breaks apart quickly. Somewhat weaker than expected reception for a 20 kW / 500 foot equivalent station whose tower is only 40 miles away, especially given lack of intermod risk.

91.3 WCSG delivers a noticeably better signal to the same region; the extra juice makes a difference.

It would not surprise me if WGRD's facilities were engineered in a fashion to intentionally maximize RF toward Grand Rapids despite its omnidirectional license.

When even moderate tropo is in play, it is not uncommon for WGRD's signal to boom into Cadillac.


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Re: Kalamazoo Nielsen audio numbers

Post by Ben Zonia » Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:43 am

Unfortunately, under newer current rules, there is no way to upgrade non directionally. And the short spacings are in three widely spaced directions. I guess you could increase maximum ERP with a panel antenna, but the ERP bragging rights would be a meaningless sales tool. Besides, you have WBCT, "The Beast" at 320 kW and WSRW "We're Slightly Reduced Watts" at 265 kW, in the market.


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