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How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

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km1125
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by km1125 » Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:10 am

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:31 am
Humor me with your math skills and calculate the number of white people killed by police officers.
MORE THAN 1,000 UNARMED people died as a result of police harm between 2013 and 2019, according to data from Mapping Police Violence. About a third of them were black.

About 17% of the black people who died as a result of police harm were unarmed, a larger share than any other racial group and about 1.3 times more than the average of 13%.
https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/20 ... e-of-color

Here's a clear picture to illustrate the point of the problem...

https://www.statista.com/statistics/585 ... e-by-race/
In the stats you provided, the police are 300% more likely to encounter an armed black person than their representative population when the encounter ends in death.



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TC Talks
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by TC Talks » Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:40 am

So this means nothing if police are doing their job to "Serve and Protect". What you are suggesting is just a tired justification.


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
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Bryce
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Bryce » Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:40 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:40 am
So this means nothing if police are doing their job to "Serve and Protect". What you are suggesting is just a tired justification.
Huh?


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

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TC Talks
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by TC Talks » Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:17 pm

Bryce wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:40 pm
TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:40 am
So this means nothing if police are doing their job to "Serve and Protect". What you are suggesting is just a tired justification.
Huh?
Police are not serving and protecting. Police officers are more likely to use deadly force against minorites. It's a broken system.


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
― Noam Chomsky

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Bryce
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Bryce » Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:12 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:17 pm
Bryce wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:40 pm
TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:40 am
So this means nothing if police are doing their job to "Serve and Protect". What you are suggesting is just a tired justification.
Huh?
Police are not serving and protecting. Police officers are more likely to use deadly force against minorites. It's a broken system.
Tis not the policing system that is broken my friend.

According to FBI/DOJ statistics, there were 4,078 African American's/Black arrested for Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter in 2019 versus 3,650 people considered to be "white" arrested for the same charge.

Lets take a look at a couple other categories from 2019:

Weapons; carrying, possessing:
African American's/Black - 45,530
Considered White - 60,494

Aggravated assault:
African American's/Black - 91,164
Considered White - 169,467

Robbery:
African American's/Black - 29,677
Considered White - 25,143

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/20 ... s/table-43

Keeping in mind that only 14.6% of the U.S. population is black, these numbers show an inordinate amount of negative police interactions in which deadly force may need to be used compared to the "white" population.

If you put 10 people in a room. Any color. I tell you two of them commit armed robberies on a regular basis and the other eight speed on occasion, who would you say is more likely to be shot and killed by a police officer.


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

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TC Talks
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by TC Talks » Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:15 pm

Here we go, can you tell me how many false convictions exist for African Americans versus white?

Are you suggesting that the police aren't targeting African Americans far more often than white people?
Black people are 7 times more likely to be wrongfully convicted of murder than white people. African Americans imprisoned for murder are more likely to be innocent ...
https://www.law.umich.edu/special/exone ... ort2.7.pdf


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
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MotorCityRadioFreak
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by MotorCityRadioFreak » Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:28 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:15 pm
Here we go, can you tell me how many false convictions exist for African Americans versus white?

Are you suggesting that the police aren't targeting African Americans far more often than white people?
Black people are 7 times more likely to be wrongfully convicted of murder than white people. African Americans imprisoned for murder are more likely to be innocent ...
https://www.law.umich.edu/special/exone ... ort2.7.pdf
Unfortunately, facts don't matter to white supremacists.


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Bryce
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Bryce » Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:44 am

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:15 pm
Are you suggesting that the police aren't targeting African Americans far more often than white people?
I shall address this question. But first, I'd like you to address two of the questions/statements addressed to you.

As posed by KM1125...
In the stats you provided, the police are 300% more likely to encounter an armed black person than their representative population when the encounter ends in death.
What say you?

I asked, somewhat rhetorically, but I'd still like a comment...
If you put 10 people in a room. Any color. I tell you two of them commit armed robberies on a regular basis and the other eight speed on occasion, who would you say is more likely to be shot and killed by a police officer.
_____________________________



What I am suggesting is that police target the people that commit crimes more often than people that don't. A University of Georgia study estimates that people with felony convictions account for eight percent of the total population. 33% of the African-American male population have a felony conviction.
According to FBI/DOJ statistics, there were 4,078 African American's/Black arrested for Murder and nonnegligent manslaughter in 2019 versus 3,650 people considered to be "white" arrested for the same charge.

Are you suggesting that police departments across the country are committing massive fraud and collusion by ignoring 15,000 murder arrests against white people and just arresting Black people for the crime of murder? Or, is it that Black people are getting arrested for the murder a white person commits?

Lets take a look at the City of New York. Almost 96 percent of all shooters and shooting victims in the Big Apple in 2019 were people of color. People of color also accounted for 73.8 percent of rape victims and 81.3 percent of the rape suspects; 69 percent of robbery victims and 93.3 percent of the robbery suspects; and 79.5 percent of felony ­assault victims and 86 percent of the assault suspects. These numbers a quite chilling considering the Black population makes up only 24% of the city. Are the police ignoring violent crime committed by white people or are they policing the areas where the most violent crime is committed?

Ask yourself this, if 96% of murder victims where white people that live in or near the upper east side, would officials be talking about defunding the police? Defunding and handcuffing the police departments and demoralizing the officers on the street have a much bigger negative effect on the communities of color than they do the lily white upscale denizens. I would go so far as to say defunding the police is most certainly racist.

I will grant you that the African American community was disproportionately arrested and imprisoned because of the Clinton/Biden 1994 anti-crime bill. (Biden helped write it and bragged about it) This certainly shouldn't be blamed on the police departments across the nation. They aren't paid/hired to make the law, their job is to enforce them.

Fortunately, Donald John Trump understood the problem and then took steps to fix it. The First Step Act, signed into law by President Trump in December of 2018, has made a lot of progress in that direction.
TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:15 pm
Black people are 7 times more likely to be wrongfully convicted of murder than white people. African Americans imprisoned for murder are more likely to be innocent ...
https://www.law.umich.edu/special/exone ... ort2.7.pdf
IT would seem you have a problem with the court system, not the police system. The police have the job to arrest people suspected of a crime. The court system is responsible for conviction.


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

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TC Talks
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by TC Talks » Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:47 am

Not just me... Even the courts are starting to evaluate how things operate. Soon you will see the removal of bail for non-violent crimes. You will see alternative courts that avoid jail time for non-violent offenders. This is the first step in righting a failed system. People aren't born murderers.

As for the other poster's questions; I would want to read the data, as so much of he puts out lacks attribution or the proper context. If the reports summary is consistent with his post then we can discuss it. At the moment I don't know where he gets his information.


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
― Noam Chomsky

Posting Content © 2024 TC Talks Holdings LP.

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Bryce
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Bryce » Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:05 am

TC Talks wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:47 am
Not just me... Even the courts are starting to evaluate how things operate. Soon you will see the removal of bail for non-violent crimes. You will see alternative courts that avoid jail time for non-violent offenders. This is the first step in righting a failed system. People aren't born murderers.
Again, that is an issue with current law, the court system, sentencing guidelines, etc. Not in the wheelhouse of policing.
TC Talks wrote:
Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:47 am
As for the other poster's questions; I would want to read the data, as so much of he puts out lacks attribution or the proper context. If the reports summary is consistent with his post then we can discuss it. At the moment I don't know where he gets his information.
He stated that the information he stated was contained in the links you provided.


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

fuzzpower
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by fuzzpower » Wed Jan 06, 2021 6:50 am

How many people who claim to love Detroit and hate the suburbs actually live in the latter? If Detroit is so great, move to the city. Me, I’ll stick to the suburbs,



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Rate This
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Rate This » Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:23 am

fuzzpower wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 6:50 am
How many people who claim to love Detroit and hate the suburbs actually live in the latter? If Detroit is so great, move to the city. Me, I’ll stick to the suburbs,
Slowly but surely people are moving into Detroit.



fuzzpower
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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by fuzzpower » Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:27 am

I can’t wait to see the 2020 census compared to 2010. The rate of decline has slowed, meaning it’s possible the city is near its bottom. I still believe more decline is near future.



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Re: How Cities Lost Control of Police Discipline

Post by Rate This » Wed Jan 06, 2021 8:20 am

fuzzpower wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:27 am
I can’t wait to see the 2020 census compared to 2010. The rate of decline has slowed, meaning it’s possible the city is near its bottom. I still believe more decline is near future.
It’s only bottomed out the last couple of years... so of course it’ll be lower than 2010. But they keep updating those numbers throughout the decade with estimates.



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