How many different songs does WCSX play?

[Round Six]

There's so much more out there...it drives me nuts that WRIF and WCSX, being sister stations, practically share a playlist these days. I understand why to a degree. If you missed "Sweet child o' mine" on WRIF, just flip to their sister station WCSX and hear it again in five minutes.

There's a question I've asked several times here on Buzzboard. None of you seem to know. But I think is something every program director and advertiser should know. How many listen to broadcast radio on a shelf radio that stays on one station, and how many are listening in a vehicle to a radio with buttons on it.

If anyone is like me, the radio in my car gets changed as soon as a commercial or chatting starts. I just want to hear tunes. No yakety yak. No traffic reports.

So getting back to the topic of this thread. Do stations intentionally play just popular tunes to catch channel changers like me? Yeah their playing Addicted To Love for the 3rd time today. But for the folks that are only in their car for an hour or two like me, we're only going to hear it once. And we're not going to hit the button again until it's over.

So like I said, just what percentage of the listening audience is like me? Apparently no one knows.

[stopnswop2]

There's so much more out there...it drives me nuts that WRIF and WCSX, being sister stations, practically share a playlist these days. I understand why to a degree. If you missed "Sweet child o' mine" on WRIF, just flip to their sister station WCSX and hear it again in five minutes.

There's a question I've asked several times here on Buzzboard. None of you seem to know. But I think is something every program director and advertiser should know. How many listen to broadcast radio on a shelf radio that stays on one station, and how many are listening in a vehicle to a radio with buttons on it.

If anyone is like me, the radio in my car gets changed as soon as a commercial or chatting starts. I just want to hear tunes. No yakety yak. No traffic reports.

So getting back to the topic of this thread. Do stations intentionally play just popular tunes to catch channel changers like me? Yeah their playing Addicted To Love for the 3rd time today. But for the folks that are only in their car for an hour or two like me, we're only going to hear it once. And we're not going to hit the button again until it's over.

So like I said, just what percentage of the listening audience is like me? Apparently no one knows.

Something I don't hear anymore is announcing a song or two that will be playing after the commercial break, to encourage the listener not to change the station.

[Mega Hertz]

There's so much more out there...it drives me nuts that WRIF and WCSX, being sister stations, practically share a playlist these days. I understand why to a degree. If you missed "Sweet child o' mine" on WRIF, just flip to their sister station WCSX and hear it again in five minutes.

There's a question I've asked several times here on Buzzboard. None of you seem to know. But I think is something every program director and advertiser should know. How many listen to broadcast radio on a shelf radio that stays on one station, and how many are listening in a vehicle to a radio with buttons on it.

If anyone is like me, the radio in my car gets changed as soon as a commercial or chatting starts. I just want to hear tunes. No yakety yak. No traffic reports.

So getting back to the topic of this thread. Do stations intentionally play just popular tunes to catch channel changers like me? Yeah their playing Addicted To Love for the 3rd time today. But for the folks that are only in their car for an hour or two like me, we're only going to hear it once. And we're not going to hit the button again until it's over.

So like I said, just what percentage of the listening audience is like me? Apparently no one knows.

Something I don't hear anymore is announcing a song or two that will be playing after the commercial break, to encourage the listener not to change the station.

If you dislike that band or that song, you're gonna change the channel. Best not to announce the commercials or the upcoming song.

[dial-it-in]

There's so much more out there...it drives me nuts that WRIF and WCSX, being sister stations, practically share a playlist these days. I understand why to a degree. If you missed "Sweet child o' mine" on WRIF, just flip to their sister station WCSX and hear it again in five minutes.

There's a question I've asked several times here on Buzzboard. None of you seem to know. But I think is something every program director and advertiser should know. How many listen to broadcast radio on a shelf radio that stays on one station, and how many are listening in a vehicle to a radio with buttons on it.

If anyone is like me, the radio in my car gets changed as soon as a commercial or chatting starts. I just want to hear tunes. No yakety yak. No traffic reports.

So getting back to the topic of this thread. Do stations intentionally play just popular tunes to catch channel changers like me? Yeah their playing Addicted To Love for the 3rd time today. But for the folks that are only in their car for an hour or two like me, we're only going to hear it once. And we're not going to hit the button again until it's over.

So like I said, just what percentage of the listening audience is like me? Apparently no one knows.

I dont know the answer regarding the breakdown of transient listeners but I think I can address the other thing:
I call them "safe" songs but I think the reality is theyre just focus tested as being recognizable and generally liked. That means a song that to the largest audience WONT change the station if they heard it...because they know it and generally like it. Now, that doesnt do folks like us who are tired of those worn out songs any good but I understand the logic of why they do it. I just think there are lots of other good, recognizable and likeable songs that could be added to the mix.

[Mega Hertz]

There is (or at least used to be) four categories for those auditorium tests.

*know it and like it
*know it and don't like it
*don't know it and like it
*don't know it and don't like it

[Mega Hertz]

Plus, they always play the hook or chorus of the songs. Wouldn't you wanna test the beginning of the song?

[craigrussell100]

"I call them "safe" songs but I think the reality is theyre just focus tested as being recognizable and generally liked. That means a song that to the largest audience WONT change the station if they heard it...because they know it and generally like it."

Good answer...but do you know WHY they (commercial radio stations) do this?

Ill hang up and listen for the answer...

[dial-it-in]

"I call them "safe" songs but I think the reality is theyre just focus tested as being recognizable and generally liked. That means a song that to the largest audience WONT change the station if they heard it...because they know it and generally like it."

Good answer...but do you know WHY they (commercial radio stations) do this?

Ill hang up and listen for the answer...

If I had to guess I'd say to maximize the ad revenue.
My contention is that a station could still maximize ad revenue by playing great rock and roll tunes that are not worn out. There are tons of recognizable and well liked songs that stations like WCSX and WLLZ ignore. Its ridiculous and an insult to our musical intelligence to think that great rock and roll has to be limited to a small group of songs.

[riggs]

"I call them "safe" songs but I think the reality is theyre just focus tested as being recognizable and generally liked. That means a song that to the largest audience WONT change the station if they heard it...because they know it and generally like it."

Good answer...but do you know WHY they (commercial radio stations) do this?

Ill hang up and listen for the answer...

If I had to guess I'd say to maximize the ad revenue.
My contention is that a station could still maximize ad revenue by playing great rock and roll tunes that are not worn out. There are tons of recognizable and well liked songs that stations like WCSX and WLLZ ignore. Its ridiculous and an insult to our musical intelligence to think that great rock and roll has to be limited to a small group of songs.

Because they don't love or care about music. They love 'numbers' but are foolish. They can't make the connection. What's the difference between a great restaurant and a mediocre one? The passion the owners and staff put into it. It matters. It makes all the difference in the world. It's why a higher-end restaurant can charge more and still be packed.

And any station that thinks they are going to program music that every single listener likes is foolish. That's impossible, so instead they make playlists that are tolerable instead of exciting or interesting. Instead, you build up trust - to a degree where listeners will think "I don't like this song, but the station will play something good next". A lot of Public stations are good at that. Everyone plays it way too safe and it's boring. I honestly think the goal is to be wallpaper, completely unnoticed, but just on. Boiling down 20-40 years of of rock music to 150-200 songs is awful. It's like overcooked oatmeal with no flavor and no added ingredients. Just hour after hour of safe. Might as well hook up a PC and put a Spotify playlist on random.

[MWmetalhead]

The piece of shit Alt 98.7 station is a perfect example of the worst kind of radio. Just take someone's PC and hook it up to a board and play a Spotify playlist on random - because that's what they are. Pure garbage. Do they have ANY local talent?

To answer your question - the only local air talent on the station is Julia (mornings). Although based in Detroit, she tracks shifts for numerous other Audacy stations - mostly CHR.

I agree that the PD - who is not local - puts minimal effort into the on-air product.

[AMFMTV]

re: tight playlists. It's the old adage... "you play the same shit over and over", but it's about (unfortunately) programming to not lose the listeners you have, rather than gaining new ones. Yes, there's a helluva lot of classic rock that can be played, even hits, but that's why there's music testing to narrow it down to the most popular.

Also "Why doesn't radio play new music from core artists?". I agree, there's good new product from library artists but MOST ppl want the familiar, even though they'll bitch about the SOS.

"play more variety.... but don't play songs I don't like (or don't know)".

[craigrussell100]

"play more variety.... but don't play songs I don't like (or don't know)".

Thats pretty close. People SAY they want variety, but they really dont. Most, unlike the musicoligists who hang out here, want to hear their favorite songs They dont want to hear unfamiliar music. Hence why music tests dont usually include new songs, or "great rock and roll" songs. Those get tested, and come back bad.

What it really boils down to, is COMMERCIAL radio is not for music discovery, or "Because they don't love or care about music". COMMERCIAL radio is an advertiser delivery method. Like TV, and Newspapers used to be, and websites. None of it about "playing great songs" or "a station could still maximize ad revenue by playing great rock and roll tunes that are not worn out. There are tons of recognizable and well liked songs that stations like WCSX and WLLZ ignore." Ratings, in a market like Detroit, are EVERYTHING. A Rating point loss can mean millions in lost revenue. Remember who dictates what radio stations do, and the audience they go after. Advertisers. And in Detroit, thats Ad Agencies.

Wanna know who doesnt care about great music? Or who doesnt love music? People buying time at ad agencies. Its all a numbers game. They look at the ratings in the demo their client wants to reach, then they pick the top 3 stations, cut checks to buy ads, and go to lunch. It really isnt much more than that.

And the big players need to satisfy stock holders and the bottom line so much that they will do ANYTHING to keep their grip on the money. So if its a choice between playing a safe well tested crispy Areosmith song, or some great jam from 11 years ago that radio ignores but has never been tested, guess what gets played. Sweet Emotion. Too much $$$ is riding every quarter hour, and every ratings point.

[Round Six]

craigrussell100:

At the top of this page I asked the question about percentages. What percent of listeners are in a vehicle with preset buttons. Let's say it's 50 percent.

And let's say of those 50 percent, half do what I do. Hit the preset as soon as a crummy commercial comes on.

Now if you were an ad exec paying out so much based on a station's ratings, isn't it sorta part of your livelihood to know just what that percentage is?

Why do I think this ratio should be something everyone involved in radio should know? Isn't that how many people you thought were listening, but are not?

[48125er]

"play more variety.... but don't play songs I don't like (or don't know)".
hose get tested, and come back bad.


And the big players need to satisfy stock holders and the bottom line so much that they will do ANYTHING to keep their grip on the money. So if its a choice between playing a safe well tested crispy Areosmith song, or some great jam from 11 years ago that radio ignores but has never been tested, guess what gets played. Sweet Emotion. Too much $$$ is riding every quarter hour, and every ratings point.

That sounds like what 100.5 the river in G.R does Or 95.7 in the throwback hours, theyll play songs a couple times a day BARELY any station has played in years for about a month then dont play them again, heres some examples ive heard recently,

Wilson/Phillips- Release me
Merril Bainbridge- Mouth
Firehouse- I live my life for you
Joshua Kadison- Beautiful in My eyes
Paula Abdul- blowing kisses in the wind
Jamie walters- Hold on
Mariah carey- Anything you need a friend
Joey McIntyre- Stay the same

[Editorcj]

The best way to measure that is to put real time meters in cars. If one were put in my car they would occasionally see my toggle between all of my presets to land on the best song option, then it might notice me forgetting to surf when a spot does come on until a spot annoys me out of complacency. It could notice me switching off a song I like but have heard too much or go back and forth cause I can't decide what I want to hear. Can any pattern be gleaned from all of those data points from a decent sample size? The question I have is what is the methodology used by the ratings companies? In TV it is pretty straight forward but radio listening is more complex.