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Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Discussion pertaining to Detroit, Ann Arbor, Port Huron, and SW Ontario
Marcus
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Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by Marcus » Sun Nov 06, 2022 2:10 pm

FM : Bell Media stations (CIMX/CIDR) About a year or two. At least one of them will be replaced. Either something that is already done in radio the markets or the Oldies from CKWW will move there. I doubt will see either The River or 89x return. The might keep the Pure Country going longer than the CHR, however.
96.3 WDVD HD-2 : See below. Alternative might end up here with 760 WJR becoming a HD-3.
98.7 WDZH : Days to weeks left. Either Audacy will move the Aternative to a HD or another company will do that.
105.1 The Bounce : 3-5 years. Old Hip-Hop will run its course as a main FM format and they will have to consider a more Rhythmic AC direction, although the Bounce name might still be there for longer than that.
106.7 WLLZ : 1-3 years. What your hearing is more of a version 3 of the old 106.7 The Drive than anything else. In its current state in neither picks up where the old 98.7 left off, nor does it match a Classic AOR playlist. Only the most listened to tunes from the best selling albums are on there.

AM : 760 WJR : About five years as an AM only News/Talk station.
1160 WCXI : This could drag on for a few years, but I think some of the WNZK programming could be played here on different slots meaning it could become a radio version of a time shift.
1460 WPON : Directional signal that misses parts of the Metro, check. Nightime interference, check. AM only, check. About three more years, maybe four.



edj
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by edj » Sun Nov 06, 2022 4:29 pm

As long as Brother Stair's cult has the cash, they will lease 1160. No reason to move WNZK programming there. I would love to see WPON and WCXI swap formats if Brother Stair has to stay on but it won't happen



SixPlusOne
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by SixPlusOne » Sun Nov 06, 2022 7:15 pm

Marcus wrote:
Sun Nov 06, 2022 2:10 pm
1160 WCXI : This could drag on for a few years, but I think some of the WNZK programming could be played here on different slots meaning it could become a radio version of a time shift.
1460 WPON : Directional signal that misses parts of the Metro, check. Nightime interference, check. AM only, check. About three more years, maybe four.
I don't see any changes at these two stations as long as Birach Broadcasting is the owner.

http://www.birach.com/



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by MWmetalhead » Sun Nov 06, 2022 8:45 pm

Why would Cumulus - with no national music platforms from which to easily procure programming - bother with Alternative on an HD-2 signal? HD only channels have negligible listenership. Besides that, WRIF already programs an indie / alternative hybrid on its HD-2 channel.

CHR on 93.9 has been generating better ratings in Essex County than Country on 88.7.

I agree 105.1 will need to evolve with time, but this isn't much different than how stations as varied as 92.3 and 104.3 have evolved with time. 105.1 will simply move its median song age forward bit by bit.

I think 106.7 will stay the course. I think iHM likes having one strongly male skewing station in its cluster to balance out the female skewing WNIC and WKQI.



MotorCityRadioFreak
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by MotorCityRadioFreak » Sun Nov 06, 2022 9:21 pm

Marcus wrote:
Sun Nov 06, 2022 2:10 pm
FM : Bell Media stations (CIMX/CIDR) About a year or two. At least one of them will be replaced. Either something that is already done in radio the markets or the Oldies from CKWW will move there. I doubt will see either The River or 89x return. The might keep the Pure Country going longer than the CHR, however.
96.3 WDVD HD-2 : See below. Alternative might end up here with 760 WJR becoming a HD-3.
98.7 WDZH : Days to weeks left. Either Audacy will move the Aternative to a HD or another company will do that.
105.1 The Bounce : 3-5 years. Old Hip-Hop will run its course as a main FM format and they will have to consider a more Rhythmic AC direction, although the Bounce name might still be there for longer than that.
106.7 WLLZ : 1-3 years. What your hearing is more of a version 3 of the old 106.7 The Drive than anything else. In its current state in neither picks up where the old 98.7 left off, nor does it match a Classic AOR playlist. Only the most listened to tunes from the best selling albums are on there.

AM : 760 WJR : About five years as an AM only News/Talk station.
1160 WCXI : This could drag on for a few years, but I think some of the WNZK programming could be played here on different slots meaning it could become a radio version of a time shift.
1460 WPON : Directional signal that misses parts of the Metro, check. Nightime interference, check. AM only, check. About three more years, maybe four.
May I ask how you came to the conclusions at the start of your posts? Obviously, I definitely agree on 98.7, but how do you know the timing for everything else?


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Marcus
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by Marcus » Sun Nov 06, 2022 10:42 pm

These were rough estimates based on the decline of AM radio in general, fewer all music stations on the standard radio bands, and the rising average age of people tuning into traditional radio.

IHeart might not dump WLLZ, but how much longer should they call it Classic Rock on the air?



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by MWmetalhead » Mon Nov 07, 2022 6:21 am

What's wrong with describing their playlist as classic rock?



stopnswop2
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by stopnswop2 » Mon Nov 07, 2022 6:44 am

MWmetalhead wrote:
Mon Nov 07, 2022 6:21 am
What's wrong with describing their playlist as classic rock?
I think a station playing 80s-2000s rock should be given a separate format. Classic Rock has always been associated with Led Zeppelin and the Rolling Stones. It's confusing.
The same reason Oldies stations playing 80s music no longer use that branding.


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MWmetalhead
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by MWmetalhead » Mon Nov 07, 2022 9:20 am

106.7 plays extremely little post 2000 rock.

The Oldies tag was partially dropped due to the negative connotation associated with the word "Old."

There are classic hits stations today that play mostly 60s and 70s music that do not use the term "Oldies."

An example would be 101.3 in Grand Rapids.



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Colonel Flagg
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by Colonel Flagg » Mon Nov 07, 2022 11:39 am

MWmetalhead wrote:
Mon Nov 07, 2022 9:20 am
106.7 plays extremely little post 2000 rock.

The Oldies tag was partially dropped due to the negative connotation associated with the word "Old."

There are classic hits stations today that play mostly 60s and 70s music that do not use the term "Oldies."

An example would be 101.3 in Grand Rapids.
WLLZ needs to split the difference, and take on WRIF, as well as WCSX. Being your "Guns & Roses, and Motley Crue Station" isn't going to attract anyone with an IQ above room temperature. I am finding myself listening to WRIF a more often and alot longer, and I am well out of the desired demographic.

WJR's infomercial line up, and mediocre talk shows are not worthy of FM.

When it became necessary to rebuild WPON, it should have been rebuilt in a brownfield area of Pontiac. It serves no purpose out in the hinterlands, and is unable to get through the noise floor. I am certain the city of Pontiac would have been pleased to add the transmitter site to the tax rolls, somewhere northwest of the old Truck & Bus site.

I think something needs to happen with 96.3. Then again, I had the same thought while working there 20 years ago, while the suits from Disney tinkered with the music. It's an uninteresting, dud station, that can't decide what it's supposed to be. An overhaul is long overdue.


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TC Talks
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by TC Talks » Mon Nov 07, 2022 2:45 pm

Explain to me why there is no Electronic station in Detroit?

H*** community of wealthy active fans 18-34
Detroit is credited with inventing the genre
The equivalent to Motown in the 1960's

Some opportunities are so obvious it's painful. Even if you don't get cumes, you get great aqh's and you'll have advertisers.


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ZenithCKLW
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by ZenithCKLW » Mon Nov 07, 2022 4:59 pm

Warning: Venting and ranting alert, TL;DR at the bottom. But I have ideas. But they'll never be adopted because we have iHeartMedia and Audacy and Cumulus.

I am so fatigued with Detroit radio due to the musical chairs of bland, generic formats. Our choices are general classic hits, general A/C, general country, general rock, general CHR pop, general news/sports/talk. Amazingly, I feel the only diverse format is religious in nature (and when I say diverse, I mean diverse WITHIN the religious "format" from Brother Stair to Christian Rock as much as I am not into religious programming). Worn and rusty cookie cutter formats seem to serve people who turn on the radio for safe background music and don't really care what they hear - what a great standard. There is no excitement in hearing Don't Stop Believin' on 8 different stations. There is not enough nuance to make me choose WNIC over WDVD, or WOMC over WNIC, or CIDR over WKQI, or WLLZ over WCSX, or even WDZH over WRIF for example. All bland, all the same. All old news.

Done well, music formats that uniquely cater to a carefully crafted range of moods, production styles, instruments or tempo, vocal styles, or whatever common element that are truly unique would grab my attention to discover new sounds. Done well, talk formats that cater to personalities, curiosities, and interests beyond politics or religion to learn new knowledge. Who listens to the radio to discover new music anymore? And whose fault is it? I listen to Spotify and streaming stations because the terrestrial broadcasters just can't get out of their own way and interest me or anyone I know. Nothing makes me turn off the radio faster than bland and predictable programming. "The All 80's Lunch" is not enticing as it simply groups music together from a certain time period. Ho hum. Nothing interesting about hearing A-Ha followed by Thompson Twins then Madonna. As nostalgic as I can be, I am not interested in what decade some music came from when I am looking for entertainment.

I am craving something new and interesting so badly, but these broadcasting corporations just can't pull a new idea out of their asses. I don't accept broadcasters who think pedantry like adding more of a certain artist in the rotation is sufficient to get me to listen. I don't want to hear any radio station formatted as classic hits, country, pop, rock - I want an entirely new and different programming strategy across the entire spectrum so I can rely on the radio to be diverse and relevant again (one station with a unique format probably won't get me to return to radio).

Radio broadcasters have a much larger pie they're competing for - if they think they can get a 15+ share and bill millions of dollars by continuing to tweak these 40 year old formats that have sent people running for other options like streaming, they're nuts. They need to stop expecting those kinds of ratings and revenues. I believe AM could be relevant again if broadcasters were able to convince listeners that it's not the place just for angry old men, religion, news, or other unentertaining programming as we've been conditioned to believe, regardless of AM's limitations.

Radio broadcasting does have limitations when compared to new technology: it's local/regional, you need a special device that isn't a phone, advertising isn't tailored, listeners can't customize content - OK, but are those valid reasons for broadcasters to "give up" and say "well that's a dead medium, you need to accept our lazy programming, and download our app for it!" Radio stations are going the Sears route due to lack of imagination and investment. You can't stimulate long term growth by simply cutting costs without new investment. I also don't accept that radio is dying a slow death because people have a way to conveniently curate their own playlists. I still want to be entertained and excited by what I hear. There's a reason Don't Stop Believin' is not on my Spotify playlist. Radio has a real opportunity to reach people in new ways - I hear so much of it while streaming. Broadcasters just don't air it because they can't monetize it the way they want, or in monetize it in comparison with their local competitors.

Imagine if we didn't have any more specialty cuisine restaurants, like Italian restaurants, American, Chinese, seafood, Indian, Mediterranean and Greek, Japanese hibachi, Mexican, steakhouses, pizza, vegan, local taste, expensive upper class, or cheap fast food, and instead we had only Applebees, TGI Fridays, Taco Bell, and McDonald's and they tried to tell you their "variety" and "diversity of cuisine options" was all you could have because that's the only kind of food that exists. That's how I feel about radio.

I bet many of you will say my ideas are unrealistic, dumb, the ideas of a radio enthusiast and not the average listener, or "will never work because..." and for that, I say sayonara to radio.

TL;DR: Broadcasters are too boring, repetitive, and unimaginative to keep me engaged so I will leave. I am willing to come back because I want to be entertained by great content, but I don't have time and attention to waste for poor, lazy programming across the entire dial.



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MWmetalhead
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by MWmetalhead » Mon Nov 07, 2022 5:02 pm

Explain to me why there is no Electronic station in Detroit?
Because the music in that genre is trash, would generate abysmal ratings, and such a station would bill very poorly.



Marcus
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by Marcus » Mon Nov 07, 2022 6:32 pm

We would have to start a conversation under New Age Radio to discuss a format like EDM. Putting it on a full powered FM in any major market 24/7? Not going to happen anytime soon.



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TC Talks
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Re: Time Left for Select Radio Stations

Post by TC Talks » Mon Nov 07, 2022 7:26 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Mon Nov 07, 2022 5:02 pm
Explain to me why there is no Electronic station in Detroit?
Because the music in that genre is trash, would generate abysmal ratings, and such a station would bill very poorly.
I bet it pulls more listeners than a 70% of the commercial stations currently in the market.

People trash public radio yet they're in the top third of the ratings if you buy the full book you will see what I'm talking about.


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