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Debt ceiling

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bmw
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Debt ceiling

Post by bmw » Sat Jan 21, 2023 11:26 am

I keep reading that the Democrats aren't willing to compromise whatsoever on the debt ceiling.

So my question is, what is the point in having one? Why not just keep printing money? And for that matter, why not just legalize counterfeiting money? We're over $31,000,000,000,000.00 in debt, so what the hell...what's another few trillion?



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FakeAndyStuart
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by FakeAndyStuart » Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 11:26 am
I keep reading that the Democrats aren't willing to compromise whatsoever on the debt ceiling.

So my question is, what is the point in having one? Why not just keep printing money? And for that matter, why not just legalize counterfeiting money? We're over $31,000,000,000,000.00 in debt, so what the hell...what's another few trillion?
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.



km1125
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by km1125 » Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:23 pm

FakeAndyStuart wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm
bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 11:26 am
I keep reading that the Democrats aren't willing to compromise whatsoever on the debt ceiling.

So my question is, what is the point in having one? Why not just keep printing money? And for that matter, why not just legalize counterfeiting money? We're over $31,000,000,000,000.00 in debt, so what the hell...what's another few trillion?
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.
Yea, that money is the credit card balance on stuff we already spent, but the real argument is not changing our ways at all and continuing to RAISE that debt instead of doing ANYTHING meaningful to pay it down, OR AT LEAST, not continuing to raise it further and further.



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Bryce
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Bryce » Sat Jan 21, 2023 1:55 pm

The Democrats aren't willing to even talk about cuts to FUTURE spending.


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

bmw
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by bmw » Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:08 pm

FakeAndyStuart wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.
Nice way of deflecting and talking down to me like I'm a 3rd grader without actually answering my question, which was, what is the point of having a debt ceiling if you can just keep raising it indefinitely?

I'm not particularly pleased with Republican-controlled spending over the past 20 years, but when it comes to Democrats - they literally want a credit card without a spending limit, and if you ask them, there is never, ever a good time to cut spending on ANYTHING (except the military).



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TC Talks
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by TC Talks » Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:58 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:08 pm
FakeAndyStuart wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.
Nice way of deflecting and talking down to me like I'm a 3rd grader without actually answering my question, which was, what is the point of having a debt ceiling if you can just keep raising it indefinitely?

I'm not particularly pleased with Republican-controlled spending over the past 20 years, but when it comes to Democrats - they literally want a credit card without a spending limit, and if you ask them, there is never, ever a good time to cut spending on ANYTHING (except the military).
Explain to me any consequences of continuing to keep our debt on pace with our needs?

This has been happening most of my adult life, and besides some political principles, I don't see many hard impacts.

We could resolve this debt issue with military austerity and no sacrifice to our security.


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
― Noam Chomsky

Posting Content © 2024 TC Talks Holdings LP.

Matt
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Matt » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:07 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:08 pm
FakeAndyStuart wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.
Nice way of deflecting and talking down to me like I'm a 3rd grader without actually answering my question, which was, what is the point of having a debt ceiling if you can just keep raising it indefinitely?

I'm not particularly pleased with Republican-controlled spending over the past 20 years, but when it comes to Democrats - they literally want a credit card without a spending limit, and if you ask them, there is never, ever a good time to cut spending on ANYTHING (except the military).
He's from ohio. You are free to ignore his drivel.


What's more pathetic: harassing an old man who is paying to do a radio show or supporting a grifter like Trump?

bmw
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by bmw » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:17 pm

TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:58 pm
Explain to me any consequences of continuing to keep our debt on pace with our needs?

This has been happening most of my adult life, and besides some political principles, I don't see many hard impacts.

We could resolve this debt issue with military austerity and no sacrifice to our security.
You don't see this as a problem sometime soon?

And in 2022, that number is up to 123%.

You think this is sustainable?

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Mega Hertz
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Mega Hertz » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:27 pm

Hey, if all this money is being spent, I could stand to have a couple hundred bucks thrown my way. Even just a new coat would be nice.


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bmw
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by bmw » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:43 pm

Mega Hertz wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:27 pm
Hey, if all this money is being spent, I could stand to have a couple hundred bucks thrown my way. Even just a new coat would be nice.
Why stop at a few hundred? Why not send everybody a check for thousands, or tens of thousands of dollars? Or maybe a million? There we go - let's make everybody a millionaire, since the national debt doesn't matter.



Mega Hertz
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Mega Hertz » Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:07 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:43 pm
Mega Hertz wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:27 pm
Hey, if all this money is being spent, I could stand to have a couple hundred bucks thrown my way. Even just a new coat would be nice.
Why stop at a few hundred? Why not send everybody a check for thousands, or tens of thousands of dollars? Or maybe a million? There we go - let's make everybody a millionaire, since the national debt doesn't matter.
Well I'm not trying to be a pig, just toss a taxpayer a few bucks.


"Internet is no more like radio than intravenous feeding is like fine dining."
-TurkeyTop

Mega Hertz
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Mega Hertz » Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:08 pm

Okay. 20 bucks, 12 pack of Coke and a pack of Newports. Settled.


"Internet is no more like radio than intravenous feeding is like fine dining."
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MWmetalhead
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by MWmetalhead » Sat Jan 21, 2023 5:33 pm

Lots of people did get thousands and thousands of "free" money from the Feds in 2020 and 2021, regardless of true need. Just sayin'.

No, it's not sustainable.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of ... ublic_debt



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TC Talks
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by TC Talks » Sat Jan 21, 2023 6:44 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:17 pm
TC Talks wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:58 pm
Explain to me any consequences of continuing to keep our debt on pace with our needs?

This has been happening most of my adult life, and besides some political principles, I don't see many hard impacts.

We could resolve this debt issue with military austerity and no sacrifice to our security.
You don't see this as a problem sometime soon?
And in 2022, that number is up to 123%.
You think this is sustainable?
Like everything, it is a cyclical trend. We are coming out of a H*** financial disruption after which the government infused everyone with money to prevent a collapse. PPE and SBA and corporate stabilization costs have a lot to do with the spike.

Like all trends, it will come back down without the theatrics your 20 boneheads in Congress seem to want to perform. It will backfire, because they do not represent a majority of the citizens.

You still haven't given me a concrete consequence of deficit spending. Your chart shows we have been doing it for decades. Why should we care if we raise the debt ceiling?

"we shouldn't" isn't an answer.


“The more you can increase fear of drugs, crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.”
― Noam Chomsky

Posting Content © 2024 TC Talks Holdings LP.

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Rate This
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Re: Debt ceiling

Post by Rate This » Sat Jan 21, 2023 7:56 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 2:08 pm
FakeAndyStuart wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:00 pm
Debt is money already spent. Spent by past administrations and other Congresses. Just like your Mastercard bill can't be "compromised" this discussion of how we pay off what we already spent can't be "compromised." The sheer lack of understanding of how government works shows thru every day.

Now, you want to talk about NEW spending? Okay, let's talk. I believe that is what many voters who chose Republicans and conservatives voted for. But not paying past bills is not the leverage that will bring the other side to the table. Just look at what happened in 2013.. Let's have some economics lessons here before we blow everything up.
Nice way of deflecting and talking down to me like I'm a 3rd grader without actually answering my question, which was, what is the point of having a debt ceiling if you can just keep raising it indefinitely?

I'm not particularly pleased with Republican-controlled spending over the past 20 years, but when it comes to Democrats - they literally want a credit card without a spending limit, and if you ask them, there is never, ever a good time to cut spending on ANYTHING (except the military).
The debt ceiling is a stupid (and possibly not constitutional) concept. We aren’t talking about future spending. We are talking about not paying for things that have already been passed by congress and the monies released to pay for the prescribed programs.

There are things the administration can do… ignore the debt ceiling is one. Congress can order the treasury to mint a $1 Trillion coin and deposit it in the federal reserve. Note that this would not be inflationary either. It’s not increasing the money supply at all. Just an accounting trick.

This entire debt problem goes back to Regan and all of the subsequent folks who have cut taxes as infinitum knowing full well that spending would NEVER be cut because nobody wants their pet project slashed. You can’t cut taxes and blow a hole in the budget repeatedly and expect us not to have a jump in debt. And now the boomers are aging out of the workforce and taking their tax contributions with them. Because of automation and the rise of college and loss of low skill jobs combined we don’t have the folks paying in as strongly as we need and we don’t have the tax levels needed to fund things like we used to.

Things were sustainable until these things started changing.



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