Acceptable registrations in the queue through March 16 at 11:00a ET have now been activated. Enjoy! -M.W.

Terms of Use have been amended effective October 6, 2019. Make sure you are aware of the new rules! Please visit this thread for details: https://www.mibuzzboard.com/phpBB3/view ... 16&t=48619

Maybe the time has come

Debate and discussion of current events and political issues across the U.S. and throughout the World. Be forewarned -- this forum is NOT for the intellectually weak or those of you with thin skins. Don't come crying to me if you become the subject of ridicule. **Board Administrator reserves the right to revoke posting privileges based on my sole discretion**
jadednihilist
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:31 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by jadednihilist » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:16 pm

Is there any single thread here where someone hasn't discredited someone by name-calling?


I'm here for a good, hearty debate, to agree and disagree respectfully, and commiserate on the current state of terrestrial radio.

bmw
Posts: 6729
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:02 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by bmw » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:17 pm

TC Shuts Up wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:09 pm
Let's make one thing perfectly clear. Anti THIS vaccine is not the same as Anti ANY vaccine. Calling people "anti-vaxxers" that gladly submit to Polio, DPT, and Influenza vaccines is just calling people you want to discredit names.
This statement I fully agree with. I'm tiring of seeing people who have legitimate reservations about taking a vaccine with an emergency-only approval status generalized as being "anti-vaxxers." The are definitely some nutjob anti-vaxxers out there. There are a lot of people who won't take the Covid vaccine who I would NOT lump into the conspiracy whackjobists.



zzand
Posts: 1710
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:16 am
Location: right here

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by zzand » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:23 pm

The general authorization for Pfizer is underway Metalhead and should be a done deal by years end, not sure where Moderna and J&J stand. The things needed for general use are more stringent but necessary IMHO. I agree with those who say it is not just those who won't take the vaccine issue. It falls on all of us because of their decision base on memes and a nutcase ex president. As for differing opinions BMW? On masks, it should be up to the individual, on vaccines, the evidence is there for all who are open minded to see and businesses have to take action since they won't. As for the wonder drug Hydoxicholorquine, people of certain ethnic backgrounds cannot take it as there is something in it that reacts badly with their bodies. This was well documented during the Korean war and while steps have been taken to improve the chances of taking it and not ending up sick as hell, it still is not safe for millions of people. I know this because I am one of those who can't take it and my father almost died after taking it while in Korea.



bmw
Posts: 6729
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:02 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by bmw » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:50 pm

zzand wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:23 pm
It falls on all of us because of their decision base on memes and a nutcase ex president.
Ugh, sometimes I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. This is simply NOT A FACTUALLY ACCURATE representation of WHY the majority of those who choose not to get vaccinated make that choice. Many who make this choice engage in a rational risk vs. reward analysis for his/her own particular situation and reach the rational conclusion that the reward does not outweigh the risk. Now you're free to criticize that decision as being the wrong one based on YOUR analysis, fine. But please stop with these broad generalizations that seek to marginalize otherwise rationally-thinking people as a bunch of nutcases incapable of making rational choices.
zzand wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:23 pm
As for differing opinions BMW? On masks, it should be up to the individual, on vaccines, the evidence is there for all who are open minded to see and businesses have to take action since they won't.
And how exactly do you draw a distinction here? Why is one form of slowing the spread of the virus (masks) up to the individual while another form (vaccination) is not?



User avatar
Bryce
Posts: 7141
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:04 pm

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by Bryce » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:01 pm

zzand wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:23 pm
It falls on all of us because of their decision base on memes and a nutcase ex president.
Umm, not all of us that have made the decision to not get vaccinated have made that decision based on "memes and a nutcase ex president.".

To suggest such is an insult and borders on name calling


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

Matt
Posts: 9853
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:18 pm
Location: Where Ben Zonia couldn't cut it

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by Matt » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm

bmw wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:36 am
I'm not going to spend any time here re-hashing where I stand on this. I've posted in great detail in several other threads my explanations for my opinion. I will simply say that you answered your own question in your original post. "The bribes of million dollar lotteries and free college haven't worked and the statistics are showing with Delta, it is the unvaccinated that are driving the new cases." There is a certain segment of the population that DOES NOT WANT TO GET VACCINATED. We (used to anyways) live in a free country. If it is the unvaccinated who are driving the current wave as you contend, then that's their problem and nobody else's. To the extent these people are unable to work for a few weeks while being sick, maybe employers should just have a policy that such illness is unpaid sick time.
The free country argument ends where the unvaccinated are impeding on others' freedoms. I understand people have the choice to not get the vaccine - the issue I have is not with "misinformation" but rather with people telling others not to get it, almost to the point they are campaigning against it. I just don't want this claim to result in more government control of our lives. I'll further state that the vaccinated people with cave syndrome are also causing unnecessary economic harm. What happened to #TrustTheScience? We need to get back to normal - this nonsense has gone on too long.


What's more pathetic: harassing an old man who is paying to do a radio show or supporting a grifter like Trump?

bmw
Posts: 6729
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:02 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by bmw » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:28 pm

Matt wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
The free country argument ends where the unvaccinated are impeding on others' freedoms. I understand people have the choice to not get the vaccine - the issue I have is not with "misinformation" but rather with people telling others not to get it, almost to the point they are campaigning against it.
Oh come on. Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Those who are pro-vaccine have been campaigning for others to get vaccinated, all the way to the level of absurdity (eg, having lottery jackpots). I've seen the TV commercials and heard the radio PSA's. Most of it is propaganda. The other side absolutely has the right to "campaign" against it. And to be fair, most of the "campaigning" I've heard form the right hasn't been in the form of "don't get the vaccine" rather it has been along the lines of "make your own decision." Can you name one prominent figure who has been actively outright telling everyone to not get vaccinated? And I'm not talking about crackpots like Alex Jones.



User avatar
Bryce
Posts: 7141
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:04 pm

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by Bryce » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:50 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:41 am
In Detroit, only 39.5% of residents have received at least one dose. Compare that to 70% in Oakland County.
Gee, maybe the various cities in Oakland County should pass local ordinances barring people from Detroit from entering their city limits for the good of public health.


New York and Chicago were all in with respect to their sanctuary status — until they were hit with the challenge of actually providing sanctuary. In other words, typical liberal hypocrisy.

bmw
Posts: 6729
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:02 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by bmw » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:59 pm

Wait, I missed that part - Detroit has low vaccination rates? When did they become a hotbed of whacko Trump-supporting populists? Because I thought that those were the only people not getting vaccinated.



zzand
Posts: 1710
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:16 am
Location: right here

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by zzand » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:39 pm

My opinion is just that, mine, you have your opinion. We can agree to disagree. The spread of misinformation by memes on social media, fringe websites, right wing talk show hosts and Trump is the cause for a H U GE number not getting the jobs. They far outnumber those who think MRNA is a not a time tested tech and think that their decision won't affect others. Like it or not, in this case a decision by one person affects people around them and in some cases could cause their death. Not entering Detroit is good for ones health pandemic or not. As for wearing a mask as compared to not getting the shot, the mask is personal protection by and large with a benefit to those around you. The vaccine is mass protection that will get us to herd immunity sooner and we can get this behind us.



bmw
Posts: 6729
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:02 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by bmw » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:44 pm

zzand wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:39 pm
The spread of misinformation...by...right wing talk show hosts...
Who? Name names. And what specific misinformation? Considering how popular right-wing talk radio is these days (tens of millions of listeners every week), then I will concede you have a fair point, IF you can provide examples.



Deleted User 14896

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by Deleted User 14896 » Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:36 pm

MWmetalhead wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:41 am
In Michigan, Detroit by far has the lowest vaccination rate of any significant city. I think in some urban communities, there are some outrageously ridiculous conspiracy theories being floated. Some are just flat out irresponsible people (we can thank the welfare state and hip-hop culture for that; yeah, I'm being politically incorrect.). In Detroit, only 39.5% of residents have received at least one dose. Compare that to 70% in Oakland County.
Like I've said before, I have a side hustle delivering legal documents and witnessing signatures, that sort of thing.
I go from Grosse Ile to Inkster, Northville to Grand Traverse Boulevard in Westland. Ecorse and da' Rouge. And in the city itself.

From what I see, it's not people believing in conspiracy theories. They don't even know about any conspiracy theories.
It's just not their world. It's a little hard to explain. They live in their own little world.
If the space shuttle blew up, most wouldn't be aware of it. Half probably couldn't tell you who their senator is.

It's like someone from Appalachia 50 years ago.
"I was born here, I grew up here, I live here, and I'll die here. What is Covid again?"
Like I said, I may of not done a great job explaining what I'm trying to say.



User avatar
craig11152
Posts: 2034
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:15 am
Location: Ann Arbor

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by craig11152 » Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:46 pm

Mike Oxlong wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:36 pm


Like I've said before, I have a side hustle delivering legal documents and witnessing signatures, that sort of thing.
I go from Grosse Ile to Inkster, Northville to Grand Traverse Boulevard in Westland. Ecorse and da' Rouge. And in the city itself.

From what I see, it's not people believing in conspiracy theories. They don't even know about any conspiracy theories.
It's just not their world. It's a little hard to explain. They live in their own little world.
If the space shuttle blew up, most wouldn't be aware of it. Half probably couldn't tell you who their senator is.

It's like someone from Appalachia 50 years ago.
"I was born here, I grew up here, I live here, and I'll die here. What is Covid again?"
Like I said, I may of not done a great job explaining what I'm trying to say.
Interesting perspective. 👍


I no longer directly engage trolls

User avatar
MWmetalhead
Site Admin
Posts: 11877
Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2004 11:23 am

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by MWmetalhead » Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:30 pm

Oh come on. Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Those who are pro-vaccine have been campaigning for others to get vaccinated, all the way to the level of absurdity (eg, having lottery jackpots).
The absurdity stems from the fact such means need to be used to compel vaccination in the first place. This bribe is being used in hopes it will save people from dying.

I share Craig's sentiment and want to thank Mike for his firsthand perspective regarding Detroit.
Umm, not all of us that have made the decision to not get vaccinated have made that decision based on "memes and a nutcase ex president.".
I think for many who have chosen not to get vaccinated, memes and unscientific claims / propaganda are a big reason. General fear of doctors, needles, whatever is another reason. Fear of side effects (understandable for those who have had COVID recently or who have a history of vaccine allergies) is yet another reason. I'm sure there are others.



User avatar
Turkeytop
Posts: 8854
Joined: Mon Aug 16, 2010 9:27 pm

Re: Maybe the time has come

Post by Turkeytop » Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:49 pm

They should pay Donald Trump to do public service ads, in which he takes credit for developing the vaccine and urges his supporters to get vaccinated.


I started out with nothing and I still have most of it.

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic